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E.D.KAIN

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Broadly speaking, the short words are the best, and the old words best of all.
Articles Posted: 42  Links Seeded: 345
Member Since: 2/2008  Last Seen: 2/10/2010

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{"contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}

Food Riots Made in the USA

News Type: Opinion — Seeded on Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:36 PM EDT
Read ArticleArticle Source: Campaign Standard
politics, global-warming, oil, energy, carbon, renewable-energy, nuclear-power, biofuel, corn, carbon-footprint
Seeded by E.D.Kain
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In order to understand the steep rise in world food prices that set off food riots in Haiti last week and toppled the government, you need to travel to Iowa. Right now, we're trying to run our cars on corn ethanol instead of gasoline. As a result, we suddenly find ourselves taking food out of the mouths of children in developing nations. That may sound harsh, but it also happens to be true.

Related Articles
Food Crisis Starts Eclipsing Climate Change WorriesThe New York SunFri Apr 2510Comments
Bring on the Right Biofuels - New York TimesThe New York TimesThu Apr 240Comments
Newly Created Microbe Produces Cellulose And Sugars For Biofuels Science DailyThu Apr 240Comments
The Seven Myths of Energy IndependenceMotherJones.comWed Apr 2319Comments
{"contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
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  • Public Discussion (47)
{"commentId":1725835,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

This is the problem with the global warming alarmist movement and the reactionary methods taken to counter it...the unintended damage is often avoidable if some thought is put into long-term effects of things such as biofuel, hybrid vehicles, and other environmentally unfriendly technologies. These same technologies are also creating a greater distance between the developing world and any chance of survival and improved living standards for people in developing nations.

{"commentId":1725835,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 6 votes
Reply#1 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 3:39 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727191,"authorDomain":"DanLS"}
Dan LS

By that logic, we should never have allowed ourselves to develop beyond hunter/gathers. Pretty much everything we do is environmentally unfriendly.

{"commentId":1727191,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"DanLS"}
  • 5 votes
#1.1 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:13 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727372,"authorDomain":"hamid"}
hamid.nyc

Well, we're going to have to choose our energy policy like we choose our presidents, the lesser of evils...

{"commentId":1727372,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"hamid"}
  • 4 votes
#1.2 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:34 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727375,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

Part of the problem has nothing to do with ethanol but the fact that China had a disaster this winter with cold weather.

{"commentId":1727375,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 4 votes
#1.3 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:35 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727499,"authorDomain":"PamelaDrew"}
Pamela Drew

the fact that China had a disaster this winter with cold weather.

How much food do you think China contributes to the global supply? They aren't feeding the third world and they aren't taking all the surplus. This is from agribusiness and factory farms destroying sustainable communities to plant gmo crops, to feed cattle to ship to the USA for 99 cent burgers!

{"commentId":1727499,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"PamelaDrew"}
  • 7 votes
#1.4 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:43 AM EDT
{"commentId":1727552,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

Lets see, when China has a food deficit, what do they do? Buy it on the open market. When Australia's crop down this past year as well the confluence of the two means that China gets the rice and other countries get squat.

{"commentId":1727552,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 5 votes
#1.5 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:23 AM EDT
{"commentId":1727650,"authorDomain":"PamelaDrew"}
Pamela Drew

It sounds reasonable space guy but it is wrong. We have a global economy and China is exporting pet food to the USA. Why are they shipping soy and corn for pets to America if there's a food and fuel shortage?

Why can't we find Americans to grow and make pet food that also saves the fuel that it takes to ship from China? This isn't about feeding people. The whole thing is created by agribusiness with shiploads of soy and corn crossing the globe and subsidy dollars making sure that local farmers in every market are driven out of business.

You can see how it is destroying farmers in Mexico, this from CNN February 2008..

MEXICO CITY, Mexico (CNN) -- Hundreds of thousands of farmers clogged central Mexico City Thursday with their slow-moving tractors, protesting the entry of cheap imported corn from the United States and Canada.

"NAFTA is very bad, very bad for Mexican consumers and for Mexican producers," said Victor Quintana, head of Democratic Farmers Front, which organized the protest.

The farmers complain that U.S. and Canadian grains are heavily subsidized and therefore undermine Mexican products.

"The NAFTA agreement is in place and that's that," said farmer Armando del Valle. "But all producers should be under equal conditions, and as Mexicans, we are not working under the same terms as our neighbors up north." Watch a tractor go up in smoke, as farmers plead their case »

Ramon Garcia, who grows corn just outside Mexico City, said he couldn't afford to fertilize his crop this year and had to rent a tractor to till his field. The work is too much work for too little return, he said.

"Corn is too cheap," Garcia said. "For me to make a profit, it has to bring in 15 pesos ($1.4) a kilo, and I can barely get 10."

The farmers say their pleas have fallen on deaf ears in the Mexican government, forcing them to take their protests to the streets.

American farmers are suffering, local farmers around the globe are bankrupted with dumping. Washington is destroying independent farming for agribusiness, simple as that!

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
July 30, 2007

ARCHER DANIELS MIDLAND REPORTS RECORD ANNUAL RESULTS

Decatur, IL — July 30, 2007 — Archer Daniels Midland (NYSE: ADM)

. Net earnings for the year ended June 30, 2007 increased 65 % to a record $ 2.162 billion - $ 3.30 per share from $ 1.312 billion - $ 2.00 per share. Net earnings for the year ended June 30, 2007 includes after tax gains on asset sales of $665 million. . Segment operating profit for the year increased 53 % to a record $ 3.161 billion from $ 2.061 billion last year on improved results from all operating segments.

"ADM delivered its third consecutive year of record earnings," said Chairman and CEO
Patricia A. Woertz. "Credit goes to the people of ADM, who delivered strong results in all our
major business segments and beat both our return and cost targets."

"We are building out the long term potential of this company. Our realignment and sale of
assets are on target. Our strategic capital projects are all on schedule, and we see adequate
global crops to meet all needs. We remain very confident in our strategic direction."

{"commentId":1727650,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"PamelaDrew"}
  • 8 votes
#1.6 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:43 AM EDT
{"commentId":1728086,"authorDomain":"Wheel"}
Wheel

Why are they shipping soy and corn for pets to America if there's a food and fuel shortage?

Because they make more money selling it as dog food in America than they do selling it to the very poor? And money matters a lot more than starving people who aren't putting a dime in the pockets of the ones with the food?

{"commentId":1728086,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"Wheel"}
  • 4 votes
#1.7 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 8:45 AM EDT
{"commentId":1728757,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

Because they make more money selling it as dog food in America than they do selling it to the very poor? And money matters a lot more than starving people who aren't putting a dime in the pockets of the ones with the food?

Wheel

Bingo! You win the prize. Great post and you are exactly right on this one.

{"commentId":1728757,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 3 votes
#1.8 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:11 AM EDT
{"commentId":1729274,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Why can't we find Americans to grow and make pet food that also saves the fuel that it takes to ship from China?

Hey, I have a purina dog food plant in my home town and a part of me wishes they would move it to China. Stinks to high heaven! :)

{"commentId":1729274,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 3 votes
#1.9 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:17 PM EDT
Reply
{"commentId":1726000,"authorDomain":"Strath3303"}
Strath3303

I would say that global warming is a real issue, but the food based ethanol movement is a generally short sighted solution, which has clearly had the mother of all consequences. A better way would be to generate ethanol from other resources such as grass, wood cellulose and trash. The first is an constantly and quickly renewable resource, the second can be replaced over a time span in decades and the third we make without fully putting to use.

Also, if we really want to cut our foreign based energy usage and cut CO2 the best way to do those things is to increase our energy efficiency through simple things like improved insulation, cutting wasted power through little things like unplugging appliances when they aren't in use. The other thing is to promote and make renewable, clean energy economically viable with fossil fuel energy. Things like Solar and Wind energy are local and regionally based jobs that can't be sent elsewhere.

{"commentId":1726000,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"Strath3303"}
  • 6 votes
Reply#2 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 4:18 PM EDT
{"commentId":1726142,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Things like Solar and Wind energy are local and regionally based jobs that can't be sent elsewhere.

And these are good things to invest in, however they are still technologically speaking, in their infancy. Nuclear power is clean, safe, and efficient. Not a single person has died in the US due to Nuclear power--compare that to coal, or the involvement and cost of middle-east oil.

{"commentId":1726142,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 5 votes
#2.1 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 4:49 PM EDT
{"commentId":1726306,"authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
rbrazys

That's not true E.D., ever hear of Chernobyl?

And as far as efficient goes, how efficient is a system that produces waste that is so toxic and long lasting that we are having trouble finding places to put it?

Did you know that to counter the growing waste problems they are selling the depleted uranium to weapons manufacturers? With it they are making bombs that will kill and deform innocent civilians well into the next century from all the isotopes they are spewing into the air and ground? If not, please read this.

{"commentId":1726306,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
  • 4 votes
#2.2 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:22 PM EDT
{"commentId":1726526,"authorDomain":"Strath3303"}
Strath3303

A valid point. So long as provisions can be made for safe storage of nuclear waste. That being said, its Nevada's white whale, they don't want it, but they wanna keep getting money for it.

{"commentId":1726526,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"Strath3303"}
  • 3 votes
#2.3 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 6:13 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727236,"authorDomain":"kimmy123"}
kiml

Just don't replace your old furnace to save energy.
The old furnaces 70 to 78% efficient, not 50% efficient.
They hardly ever broke down. Parts were cheap.
The new furnaces break down regularly and the parts are modular, meaning that we throw out a module with good parts to remove a bad part. A waste of energy. Modular parts cost more.
So, parts cost more, more service calls, more wasted energy.
In case you wonder how I got to this conclusion.
I have been in the heating business for over 30 years.

{"commentId":1727236,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"kimmy123"}
  • 1 vote
#2.4 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:29 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727367,"authorDomain":"hamid"}
hamid.nyc

rbrazys,

"They have to be held accountable," Rokke said, naming President George W. Bush, Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, and British prime minister Tony Blair. They chose to use DU weapons and "totally disregarded the consequences."

Thanks for that link, wow, that is a crime against humanity. All the while Bush is warning us of the evildoers dropping dirty bombs on us, he's been using them on our own troops over in Iraq and Afghanistan. Why is it, that with everything this administration claims the enemy is doing, we find out it's really us that's doing it?

{"commentId":1727367,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"hamid"}
  • 6 votes
#2.5 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:33 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727382,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

That's not true E.D., ever hear of Chernobyl?

Uhm, I said the US. Chernobyl is kind of in, you know, Russia....

And that's the only time that anyone has died because of Nuclear power.

And as far as efficient goes, how efficient is a system that produces waste that is so toxic and long lasting that we are having trouble finding places to put it?

Actually, the system of storing nuclear waste is far less detrimental to the environment than the waste produced from natural gases and fossil fuels.

{"commentId":1727382,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 6 votes
#2.6 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:37 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727490,"authorDomain":"hamid"}
hamid.nyc

Not to mention that the Soviets had virtually no regulatory system in place at all. There were no safety precautions taken, pretty much like most Soviet programs...

{"commentId":1727490,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"hamid"}
  • 5 votes
#2.7 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:35 AM EDT
{"commentId":1727603,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Not to mention that the Soviets had virtually no regulatory system in place at all. There were no safety precautions taken, pretty much like most Soviet programs...

Exactly. And modern technology could produce the safest most efficient plants ever--far better than the ones we have now.

{"commentId":1727603,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 3 votes
#2.8 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:04 AM EDT
{"commentId":1729267,"authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
rbrazys

Fair enough, I missed 'US', but saying because nobody has died from it doesn't make it safe.
Nobody has died from smoking marijuana but that's considered dangerous isn't it?

I guess my point is that it's the possibility for major catastrophe that makes me think we shouldn't be building new nuke plants at will.

{"commentId":1729267,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
  • 1 vote
#2.9 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:15 PM EDT
{"commentId":1729275,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Nobody has died from smoking marijuana but that's considered dangerous isn't it?

Depends on who you ask. I think marijuana is a benign and misunderstood plant. I don't smoke it (anymore) but I think it should be legalized. It's certainly not dangerous, and the tax revenues from legal pot would be a lot nicer than the loads of wealth spent on trying to keep it illegal.

{"commentId":1729275,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 2 votes
#2.10 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:18 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730065,"authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
rbrazys

Way to take off on a tangent there. Don't care to respond to the actual point I was making.. maybe you started puffing again...

{"commentId":1730065,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
  • 1 vote
#2.11 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:21 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730251,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

I guess my point is that it's the possibility for major catastrophe that makes me think we shouldn't be building new nuke plants at will.

The new plants are extremely safe and clean. They would be far safer and less likely to cause catastrophe than continued mining for coal, which is obviously dangerous and much less clean.

And no, rbrazys, I'm not puffing again, though sometimes my mind is as fuzzy. This, however, is due to sleepless nights caused by my baby daughter--a far better reason in my opinion.

I didn't mean to avoid responding to your point. The tangent occurred accidentally.

Cheers.

{"commentId":1730251,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 2 votes
#2.12 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 3:58 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730485,"authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
rbrazys

I agree, they are safer and cleaner but it's also my opinion that until they can implement nuclear fusion in the plants (instead of the messy fission) that we should continue to hold off building more.

In the meantime there are other alternatives that are even cleaner and more sustainable than nuclear power.

{"commentId":1730485,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
  • 1 vote
#2.13 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 4:55 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730554,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

In the meantime there are other alternatives that are even cleaner and more sustainable than nuclear power.

Wind and solar are noble and excellent resources that we should continue to develop--but they are still in their infancy. By no means should we stop research and development of these technologies, but they have a long way yet before they become as efficient as nuclear. Besides, using these alongside nuclear would be even better. The further we can distance ourselves from fossil fuels, the better.

...though we should be looking into Canada's tremendous oil reserves as well as (and I'm going to get trampled on for this one) the Alaska oil reserves.

{"commentId":1730554,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 1 vote
#2.14 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:17 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730693,"authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
rbrazys

Hehe, This conversation has tailed off into one going on here.

We should get back to talking about food shortages, yeah?

{"commentId":1730693,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"rbrazys"}
  • 1 vote
#2.15 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 5:52 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730775,"authorDomain":"Strath3303"}
Strath3303

Relatively speaking, I would agree that solar is a relatively new technology. However, Solar has come a long way since the 70s. I think at this point another 20-30% cost reduction in solar panels and it can be cost effective and competitive with oil and coal. As for wind, humans have been harnessing wind power for a long time, windmills anyone? Both areas are promising soon and should be promoted by subsidies or tax credits to consumers using green energy. I don't say that these and other ideas are in and of themselves a panacea, but with good planning it can reduce our dependence on external energy resources. Also, wind and solar are not universally applicable, but they do have competitive advantage in certain places, eg Solar in the Southwest, wind in Michigan and parts of the intermountain region, etc.

{"commentId":1730775,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"Strath3303"}
  • 2 votes
#2.16 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:22 PM EDT
{"commentId":1730842,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

We should get back to talking about food shortages, yeah?

Totally. About them food shortages, then...

I heard on the radio today that Sam's Club is limiting the number of bags of rice per customer, and Costco is following suit. Also, Safeway has had record profits--through the roof profits.

Big Grocery?

{"commentId":1730842,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 1 vote
#2.17 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 6:41 PM EDT
Reply
{"commentId":1726373,"authorDomain":"lele"}
Leah M

I'm so glad you found/seeded this article. I've been hearing these things about this for awhile, and it's time to spread the awareness.

{"commentId":1726373,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"lele"}
  • 5 votes
Reply#3 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 5:40 PM EDT
{"commentId":1726885,"authorDomain":"eric-albert"}
Eric AlbertDeleted
{"commentId":1726889,"authorDomain":"eriktheread"}
Erik the Read

Here are some tricks for saving energy in your home if you live in a cold place:
1. You need a thermostat on your main heat source, that way anything warm will contribute to the heating - light bulbs, people, cooking, without overheating the room.
2. Put on a sweater indoors in winter
3. Save the bath tub water, don't let it run out until it has cooled
4. If you use a razor or blades, don't shave with the hot water running
5. If you sleep with the bed room window open, close the bed room door.
6. If you want to air out your home, do it quickly by creating a draft. Don't let inside walls or furniture get cold.
7. Pull the curtains. That way you trap the cooled air along the window panes.

But some modern insulation techniques are simply too efficient. People start breathing the chemicals in building materials and houses trap radon gas from the ground.

Now I'm moving from a cold place to a very hot place, does anyone have some good advise for me?

{"commentId":1726889,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"eriktheread"}
  • 4 votes
Reply#5 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:12 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727017,"authorDomain":"kylen"}
KyleN

Now I'm moving from a cold place to a very hot place, does anyone have some good advise for me?

Buy a house with tall ceilings if you can afford one.
Use ceiling fans or really any fans to move air, it feels cooler with less AC.
If you are moving to dry and hot use heat pumps, super efficient for cooling but don't work as well in humidity.
The opposite of wearing a sweater indoors, strip :)
Put shade trees around your house the more the merrier.
South facing windows need blinds or heavy drapes, maybe treated windows anything to cut down letting the sun shine in and roast the inside. In college I put tin foil like stuff in the window and it worked great kinda like you get in cars for the windshield.

I've lived mainly in Texas and for awhile Saudi Arabia so I know a bit about living in the heat.

{"commentId":1727017,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"kylen"}
  • 5 votes
#5.1 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:08 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727083,"authorDomain":"eriktheread"}
Erik the Read

Thanks Kyle. I've cut and pasted your advise to my scrap file. So far I have installed tinted double glazing on all windows. The place is Hainan, Southern China and humidity is formidable. Heavy drapes? I'd never have guessed, I though they'd just store the heat.

{"commentId":1727083,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"eriktheread"}
  • 4 votes
#5.2 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 9:38 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727381,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

How about developing nuclear fusion and then we all will have enough clean energy for a million years.

{"commentId":1727381,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 5 votes
#5.3 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:36 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727492,"authorDomain":"hamid"}
hamid.nyc

Right space guy, fusion reactors are the way to go. And we have to remember that current designs are much safer and more efficient than those of the past...

{"commentId":1727492,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"hamid"}
  • 5 votes
#5.4 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:37 AM EDT
{"commentId":1728739,"authorDomain":"kylen"}
KyleN

You want to reflect it back out the window, so heavy and black would be bad but heavy (solid non-transparent) and white would be good. Many white drapes are the little flimsy see through stuff and that doesn't do much good. I use blinds, plastic (pseudo-wood) and thick overlapping so when they are closed it's a fairly solid white wall behind the window.

Hotels do this usually with heavy drapes with white plastic backing so the part facing the window is white plastic and the part you see is some dark pattern. That probably works good, I haven't personally tried it at home.

I like the duel approach, cut my energy requirements in passive ways like building design. Then invest in research for fusion or build outs of nuclear plants to get prices down (amongst other research). I don't think cutting out what we do is a smart way to go about things, we need an advanced and working society to provide the surplus that allows for science advances. Severely cutting mobility, and quality of life is going to reduce what we can spend on science and act as a reinforcing drain until we get nowhere and are all miserable at the same time.

{"commentId":1728739,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"kylen"}
  • 5 votes
#5.5 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:06 AM EDT
Reply
{"commentId":1726949,"authorDomain":"Wheel"}
Wheel

3. Save the bath tub water, don't let it run out until it has cooled

I thought I was the only one who did this!

{"commentId":1726949,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"Wheel"}
  • 3 votes
Reply#6 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:34 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727393,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

Eric is impervious to such suggestions.

{"commentId":1727393,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 3 votes
Reply#7 - Wed Apr 23, 2008 11:42 PM EDT
{"commentId":1727503,"authorDomain":"look-upon-me"}
look-upon-me

The ethanol craze has nothing to do with environmentalism or global warming...it's politicos and lobbyists representing agribusiness interests cashing in on a trend to pile even more pork on the farm bill. The farm bill is pretty much the biggest scam ever.

{"commentId":1727503,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"look-upon-me"}
  • 4 votes
Reply#8 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:46 AM EDT
{"commentId":1727556,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

Actually it started with the enviros a few years ago but now the run screaming from any mention of it. Just like the bumper stickers I remember from the 70's during the anti-nuclear craze then. "Split Wood Not Atoms" was popular and it was supporting anthropogenic global warming and clear cutting of forests.

Not real bright.

{"commentId":1727556,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 3 votes
#8.1 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:25 AM EDT
{"commentId":1727608,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

Not real bright.

This is the problem with alarmists--which many of the "environmentalist" crowd tend to be. They don't think far enough ahead; they are too eager to solve it all at once. A little caution can go a long way.

This isn't to say that we should ignore the problems we face with pollution and sustainability--we just shouldn't blow things out of proportion and come up with fixes that turn out to be more harmful than the original problem. Or just plain useless.

{"commentId":1727608,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 3 votes
#8.2 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:06 AM EDT
{"commentId":1727659,"authorDomain":"PamelaDrew"}
Pamela Drew

-we just shouldn't blow things out of proportion and come up with fixes that turn out to be more harmful than the original problem. Or just plain useless.

No indeed, that's what we have Congress for!

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  • 5 votes
#8.3 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 2:56 AM EDT
{"commentId":1728764,"authorDomain":"wingod"}
space guy

Pamela

Sometimes you are just priceless!

(I mean that in the good way just to make sure that you know)

{"commentId":1728764,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"wingod"}
  • 4 votes
#8.4 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 11:12 AM EDT
{"commentId":1729291,"authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
E.D.Kain

No indeed, that's what we have Congress for!

So true!

{"commentId":1729291,"threadId":"254595","contentId":"1448602","authorDomain":"neoconstant"}
  • 2 votes
#8.5 - Thu Apr 24, 2008 1:21 PM EDT
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